美国国家公共电台 NPR How One Mom Talks To Her Sons About Hate On The Internet

 

SCOTT SIMON, HOST:

Do you have white teenage sons? Listen up. So begins a thread on Twitter this week by Joanna Schroeder that continues, quote, "social media and vloggers are actively¹ laying groundwork in white teens to turn them into alt-right white supremacists."

Joanna Schroeder is a writer and mother of three in Southern California and joins us now. Thank you for being with us.

JOANNA SCHROEDER: Thank you for having me, Scott.

SIMON: You have, I gather, two sons and a daughter. What did you notice online?

SCHROEDER: You know, I noticed that the more time my kids spent on YouTube and on social media, especially Instagram, the more they were raising questions that showed me that they were being exposed to some extreme right-wing propaganda.

SIMON: Well, like what specifically?

SCHROEDER: So for instance, my son came to me, and he asked, why is it that white people can't borrow black people's culture but black people can steal from white people culture? And he also asked questions about transgender folks that seemed like they came from places other than us. We've talked to our kids about LGBTQ community. We know trans people personally. And so one of my kids said, if you can be trans and just decide what you are, then how come you can't just decide to be a penguin²? Which sounds kind of like a normal kid question, but I also wanted to know where is this coming from?

SIMON: Yeah.

SCHROEDER: And when one of my sons answered, well, I saw a meme on Instagram, I knew it was time to start looking at their social media use and figuring out what they were being exposed to.

SIMON: So what did you notice?

SCHROEDER: So, you know, the way I use Instagram is I look at my news feed and I see pictures of my friends' babies and my mom's vacation. The way they use Instagram is so different. They switch over to their Explore screen, and they see photos and memes that are related to the things they've been searching and the things they've been liking³ and watching of their friends. So what I noticed was there was a lot of joke memes that were about Nazis⁴ or Hitler or about, you know, feminazis.

And then when I started looking at their YouTube use, that's when I started to get more concerned. What I found was that my kids were looking at, you know, how to build a certain thing in Minecraft or what was happening in Fortnite, but what was being suggested over to the right were videos by political vloggers. And they frame their sort of right-wing propaganda as jokes and funny and, you know, ha, ha, ha, this about feminists⁵. The more the kids watch that suggested video, the more extremist the videos that are suggested to them become.

SIMON: I have to ask. I mean, did you say to your kids, show this to us, tell us what your - show us what you're seeing?

SCHROEDER: Yeah, we did. We - the first thing we wanted to make sure was that we didn't approach it with any shaming because they're kids. And we can't expect them to automatically be able to detect propaganda when it's being presented to them. But beyond that, I think when you start to mock or roll your eyes or be like, that's garbage, that's trash, your kids shut you out.

So instead, we inquired more. Where did you hear this? Where did you see this? Can you show me that? And when they showed us, I - the first thing we tried to do was say, I get why this seems funny on the surface, and I totally get why it's confusing. And they were also younger at the time, so they were probably a little more open than a kid would be at 16 or 17.

SIMON: Well, you anticipate one of my questions as you talk about as youngsters age. I mean, don't teens manage to find a way to evade⁶ the best parental⁷ advice in any case?

SCHROEDER: Oh, yeah, for sure. I mean, what I hoped that we were able to build with our kids from when they were young is a foundation where they believe that when we say something is not great, maybe they disobey, but deep inside there's a little voice that's going to say to them, you know, I should question this. I should question why this seems so, you know, funny and, yet, I feel like I have to keep it a secret. But, you know, we have had parental filters on our computers and on our media. As the kids got older, we realized pretty much every kid can evade any filter.

SIMON: What about the girls in your sons' classes?

SCHROEDER: When a friend of mine pointed⁸ out that her daughter was being targeted by boys at school using a lot of these kinds of memes and words that they were learning from these extremists, I was devastated⁹. And she told me her daughter was getting images of guns in her direct messages and, you're a feminazi and feminazis are - should be eliminated from this Earth. And to a 13-year-old girl, it's really scary.

SIMON: As a writer, have you figured out why some people find this stuff appealing?

SCHROEDER: Yeah. I think there's a vulnerable group of boys, and even men, in society that - and I don't know who the forces are online. I don't know if it's malevolent¹⁰ media or just vloggers that want more views, but they've learned that they can target these men and boys. With men, I learned it's a lot of men who are male survivors¹¹ of sexual assault or men who've been disenfranchised from their economic opportunities, divorced men. These communities target those men and their willingness to believe that society is out to get white men, their willingness to believe that women are all money-grabbing social climbers.

And with boys, I do think neurodivergent boys are being targeted, kids who may have learning difficulties, kids who have - are on the autism spectrum¹². But it's not just those boys. I think at this age, they're trying to figure out where they fit. They're insecure. They feel like girls have it all. Girls are happy and pretty, and white men are the enemies. And so these right-wing groups are tapping into that shame and feeding it to try and propagandize to them.

SIMON: How does this make you feel about boys these days?

SCHROEDER: You know, I worry for all of our kids, the way that, you know, propaganda is being spread online. But what I've noticed about boys of this generation is that they're also the most open-hearted, potentially kindest, critical thinking, loving, group of boys that I've ever seen. They hug other people's moms. They high-five and hug each other. And I think the potential for real greatness is there with our boys.

SIMON: Joanna Schroeder, writer and a mother in Southern California. Thank you so much.

SCHROEDER: Thank you so much for having me.

(SOUNDBITE OF MUSIC)

1 actively   

adv.积极地，勤奋地

参考例句：

• During this period all the students were actively participating.在这节课中所有的学生都积极参加。
• We are actively intervening to settle a quarrel.我们正在积极调解争执。

2 penguin   

n.企鹅

参考例句：

• The penguin is a flightless bird.企鹅是一种不会飞的鸟。
• He walked with an awkward gait like a penguin.他走路的步子难看得就像企鹅。

3 liking   

n.爱好；嗜好；喜欢

参考例句：

• The word palate also means taste or liking.Palate这个词也有“口味”或“嗜好”的意思。
• I must admit I have no liking for exaggeration.我必须承认我不喜欢夸大其词。

4 Nazis   

n.（德国的）纳粹党员( Nazi的名词复数 )；纳粹主义

参考例句：

• The Nazis worked them over with gun butts. 纳粹分子用枪托毒打他们。 来自《简明英汉词典》
• The Nazis were responsible for the mass murder of Jews during World War Ⅱ. 纳粹必须为第二次世界大战中对犹太人的大屠杀负责。 来自《简明英汉词典》

5 feminists   

n.男女平等主义者，女权扩张论者( feminist的名词复数 )

参考例句：

• Only 16 percent of young women in a 1990 survey considered themselves feminists. 在1990年的一项调查中，只有16%的年轻女性认为自己是女权主义者。 来自辞典例句
• The organization had many enemies, most notably among feminists. 这个组织有许多敌人，特别是在男女平等主义者中。 来自辞典例句

6 evade   

vt.逃避，回避；避开，躲避

参考例句：

• He tried to evade the embarrassing question.他企图回避这令人难堪的问题。
• You are in charge of the job.How could you evade the issue?你是负责人，你怎么能对这个问题不置可否？

7 parental   

adj.父母的；父的；母的

参考例句：

• He encourages parental involvement in the running of school.他鼓励学生家长参与学校的管理。
• Children always revolt against parental disciplines.孩子们总是反抗父母的管束。

8 pointed   

adj.尖的，直截了当的

参考例句：

• He gave me a very sharp pointed pencil.他给我一支削得非常尖的铅笔。
• She wished to show Mrs.John Dashwood by this pointed invitation to her brother.她想通过对达茨伍德夫人提出直截了当的邀请向她的哥哥表示出来。

9 devastated   

v.彻底破坏( devastate的过去式和过去分词)；摧毁；毁灭；在感情上（精神上、财务上等）压垮adj.毁坏的；极为震惊的

参考例句：

• The bomb devastated much of the old part of the city. 这颗炸弹炸毁了旧城的一大片地方。
• His family is absolutely devastated. 他的一家感到极为震惊。

10 malevolent   

adj.有恶意的，恶毒的

参考例句：

• Why are they so malevolent to me?他们为什么对我如此恶毒？
• We must thwart his malevolent schemes.我们决不能让他的恶毒阴谋得逞。

11 survivors   

幸存者，残存者，生还者( survivor的名词复数 )

参考例句：

• The survivors were adrift in a lifeboat for six days. 幸存者在救生艇上漂流了六天。
• survivors clinging to a raft 紧紧抓住救生筏的幸存者

12 spectrum   

n.谱，光谱，频谱；范围，幅度，系列

参考例句：

• This is a kind of atomic spectrum.这是一种原子光谱。
• We have known much of the constitution of the solar spectrum.关于太阳光谱的构成，我们已了解不少。