华盛顿邮报 美堕胎权裁决如何帮助拜登扭转选情？(2)（在线收听）

I wanted to know, is abortion something that's actually motivating voters to turn out in a new way?

我想知道的是，堕胎真的能激励选民以一种新的方式投票吗?

Is this driving people to the polls who maybe were kind of disinterested before or just didn't think it was worth it to turn out for Democrats?

这是否驱使那些以前可能不感兴趣或只是认为不值得为民主党投票的人去投票?

And is this something that's actually persuading voters, as well?

这也能说服选民投票吗?

And that's where we talk about independents, especially independent women.

这里我们谈到了独立，特别是独立女性。

And there's just massive evidence that they actually are shifting away from the GOP and toward the Democrats because of this issue.

有大量证据表明，由于这个问题，她们实际上正从共和党转向民主党。

And what were the conversations that made that clear to you?

哪些对话让你明白了这一点?

I talked to some of the new registrants in Pennsylvania, where you do see this surge of women, in particular, signing up right after Roe v. Wade is overturned.

我和宾夕法尼亚州的一些注册的新选民谈过，你确实可以看到，特别是在罗伊诉韦德案被推翻后，注册的女性人数激增。

And, you know, in the big picture, it's kind of a drop in the bucket -- like, these new voters alone -- they're not going to change the course of an election.

从大局来看，这些新选民有点像沧海一粟，她们并不会改变选举的进程。

But it's a pretty clear sign that, you know, this is something that matters to women so much that it could actually change the composition of the people who are registering.

但有一个非常明显的迹象，这对女性来说非常重要，以至于实际上可能会改变注册人的构成。

And explain more about Pennsylvania and why it's an important state when we're thinking about this question of abortion access and how that is going to play out in elections.

请解释关于宾夕法尼亚州的更多情况，解释当我们思考堕胎途径的问题，以及这将如何在选举中发挥作用时，为什么宾夕法尼亚是一个重要的州。

I feel like people don't talk about abortion and its role in the Pennsylvania elections enough because, you know, I personally -- I'd heard a lot more about the role of abortion in, you know, Michigan elections and Wisconsin elections, where you've had these old near-total bans on the books that have just brought the issue front and center.

我觉得人们对堕胎及其在宾夕法尼亚州选举中的作用谈论得不够多，因为，我个人听说过很多关于堕胎在密歇根州和威斯康星州选举中所扮演的角色的情况，在这两个州，会实施记录在册的十分古老的禁令，这些禁令只是把这个问题放在了突出的位置。

And clearly, you know, that will play a huge role.

很明显，这将发挥巨大的作用。

But it's really on the line in Pennsylvania in an interesting way because it's currently legal.

但这在宾夕法尼亚州会以一种有趣的方式冒很大的险，因为它目前是合法的。

And yet, you know, the governor's race in Pennsylvania could really decide the fate of abortion access there because you have super clear contrast between the candidates

然而，宾夕法尼亚州的州长竞选可能真的会决定那里堕胎权的命运，因为候选人之间的对比非常明显

and you have a Republican-controlled statehouse that has indicated interest in significantly restricting the procedure if they have a Republican governor to sign that bill.

共和党控制的州众议院表示，如果共和党州长签署该法案，他们有兴趣大幅限制该程序。

And who is the candidate that is advocating for those increased restrictions on abortion access?

谁是支持增加堕胎限制的候选人?

The Republican nominee in Pennsylvania for the governor's race is Doug Mastriano, and he authored, as a state legislator, a heartbeat bill, which would ban abortion after about six weeks, and that's before a lot of women know they're pregnant.

宾夕法尼亚州的共和党州长候选人是道格·马斯特里亚诺，他作为州议员发起了一项心跳法案，该法案将在怀孕约六周后禁止堕胎，很多女性往往在六周后才知道自己已经怀孕。

And he's also been pretty vocally against some common exceptions to those bans for, you know, rape and incest.

他还大声地反对这些禁令中的一些常见例外情况，你知道，强奸和乱伦。

There's just a lot of fear, I think, among advocates of abortion access about what policy could look like under Mastriano.

我认为，倡导堕胎权利的人对马斯特里亚诺领导下的政策会是什么样子有很大的担忧。