美国国家公共电台 NPR Kurdish General Slams U.S.-Syria Policy; Gen. Petraeus Calls Withdrawal 'A Betrayal'

 

MICHEL MARTIN, HOST:

We're going to begin with what has been one of the most explosive and potentially consequential¹ weeks in the Trump² administration so far and a week that seen the president's penchant³ for breaking long-held norms of governance applied⁴ to sensitive matters of international affairs and national security. To review, State Department witnesses have told Congress about a shadow foreign policy being conducted by the president's personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani. And the White House chief of staff publicly confirmed that the president did demand concessions⁵ from Ukraine's president in exchange for aid and other engagement with the United States. And the president's abrupt⁶ pullout of U.S. troops from Northern Syria, abandoning longtime Kurdish allies, has sparked a cascade⁷ of reactions including an incursion of Russian troops into the area.

That move has prompted strong objections from some of the president's most reliable supporters as well as a number of former top military leaders. We're going to hear from one of them now - retired⁸ U.S. Army General David Petraeus. He's led U.S. forces in Iraq and Afghanistan, served as commander of U.S. Central Command, where he oversaw⁹ military operations in the Middle East, and was later CIA director.

General Petraeus, thank you so much for joining us.

DAVID PETRAEUS: Good to be with you, Michel. Thanks.

MARTIN: So just to briefly¹⁰ summarize where we are right now, the president ordered this abrupt pullout of troops from northern Syria after a phone call with Turkey's president, who has long wanted to get Kurdish forces away from Turkey's border. And, as many people know, Kurdish forces have been working with the U.S. forces for years to combat violent extremists. The vice¹¹ president and secretary of state went to negotiate a cease-fire between Turkey and Kurdish forces in northern Syria. But our reporting indicates that that cease-fire is shaky. So I'd like to ask you to begin with, what's your number one concern at this point in Syria?

PETRAEUS: Well, a week ago, when this policy was first announced, I said publicly that I had four concerns. One was that it might enable an ISIS resurgence¹². The second - that it could essentially¹³ enable ethnic¹⁴ displacement¹⁵ - perhaps even ethnic cleansing¹⁶. Third, that it would give a victory to Iran and Russia and the murderous Syrian dictator, Bashar al-Assad. And then, fourth, it would call our credibility as allies and partners into question. And unfortunately, frankly¹⁷, I think that those concerns have been operationalized, have been borne out.

I agree very much with Lindsey Graham, a close ally of the president and, frankly, a longtime friend, and Senator McConnell, who assessed this withdrawal¹⁸ of U.S. forces from Syria as a grave strategic mistake - his words. And I also spent four years in Iraq, so I know the Kurds in Iraq very, very well as well. You know, the Kurds always used to say that the Kurds have no friends but the mountains. And I would reassure¹⁹ them, and I would say Americans are your friends. We have conducted Operation Northern Watch essentially to protect you for decades. And we are here now, and we will not desert you. And, sadly, this is arguably a betrayal.

MARTIN: Would there have been a good way to exit Syria? I mean, the president has been saying that this was something he campaigned on. This was a campaign promise, and he is simply fulfilling it. And I think his - the implication is that people should not have been surprised that this is his decision. You've laid out, you know, a number of consequences that you see. But would there have been a way to accomplish this without causing all the effects that you have described?

PETRAEUS: Well, first of all, let me just note that I don't think anyone understands the desire to end endless wars more than those who are privileged to command our men and women in uniform in those very challenging wars. And, of course, I commanded Iraq at the height of the operation, the surge, and then the same in Afghanistan and the overall region. So, again, I fully²⁰ understand it. And I absolutely understand the need to keep the cost - to reduce the cost, especially in blood and treasure, to an absolute minimum.

But we've essentially done that. I mean, we had less than 1,500 - perhaps even less than that. And yes, some of those are the very high-demand, low-density special operations forces that have played such an important role in this particular campaign. But surely that's affordable²¹ for the world's only military superpower. Surely that is a price that we should be willing to assume given that what we were doing was not in the fighting on the front lines. We were enabling those who were doing that.

MARTIN: You noted²² that Senator McConnell, Senator Graham are political supporters of the president, members of his party. But what's notable about the current moment is that many other former military leaders have been outspoken²³ about this in their criticism of these actions in Syria. And many of them indicate that this is something that is not comfortable for them to do - that their normal inclination²⁴ is not to be outspoken about a policy decision made by the commander in chief. But why do you think this is the issue that's caused a number of these people to speak out who otherwise are inclined not to do that?

PETRAEUS: Well, I think there has been an accumulation of worries, if you will, about - by the way, not just about the president, who's quite proud to describe himself as a disrupter in chief. This is about more than that. It's actually about the disruption of democracy in Washington - in particular, the inability of Congress to even do its most basic functions. Our Department of Defense²⁵ is once again under a continuing resolution. They haven't passed a budget for it. We have these periodic threats to shut down government or actual shutdowns of parts of government.

And I think again that the inclination by most of my old comrades and certainly my inclination has been to perhaps comment on policy from time to time but generally to avoid certainly becoming perceived as partisan²⁶. But clearly, a couple of very high-profile old battlefield comrades of mine have felt the need to go beyond that. And there is a real concern.

MARTIN: Given everything that you've said, given how chaotic²⁷ and so forth²⁸ the situation now is, what is the most productive role for the U.S. right now in your view?

PETRAEUS: Well, we have to salvage²⁹ what can be salvaged³⁰ in the fight against the Islamic State. We have to try to get into a political process which now the Iran and Russia and Bashar al-Assad have - clearly have an upper hand. We have to take care of those refugees who are being pushed out of their homes or fleeing from their homes because of the agreement that has been made. And somehow, we have to also try to shore up our international credibility at a time when it has been called into question.

MARTIN: That was General David Petraeus. He's the former commanding general in both Afghanistan and Iraq, a former head of the CIA.

General, thank you so much for talking with us today.

PETRAEUS: A pleasure, Michel. Thanks.

1 consequential   

adj.作为结果的，间接的；重要的

参考例句：

• She was injured and suffered a consequential loss of earnings.她受了伤因而收入受损。
• This new transformation is at least as consequential as that one was.这一新的转变至少和那次一样重要。

2 trump   

n.王牌，法宝；v.打出王牌，吹喇叭

参考例句：

• He was never able to trump up the courage to have a showdown.他始终鼓不起勇气摊牌。
• The coach saved his star player for a trump card.教练保留他的明星选手，作为他的王牌。

3 penchant   

n.爱好，嗜好；（强烈的）倾向

参考例句：

• She has a penchant for Indian food.她爱吃印度食物。
• He had a penchant for playing jokes on people.他喜欢拿人开玩笑。

4 applied   

adj.应用的；v.应用，适用

参考例句：

• She plans to take a course in applied linguistics.她打算学习应用语言学课程。
• This cream is best applied to the face at night.这种乳霜最好晚上擦脸用。

5 concessions   

n.（尤指由政府或雇主给予的）特许权( concession的名词复数 )；承认；减价；（在某地的）特许经营权

参考例句：

• The firm will be forced to make concessions if it wants to avoid a strike. 要想避免罢工，公司将不得不作出一些让步。
• The concessions did little to placate the students. 让步根本未能平息学生的愤怒。

6 abrupt   

adj.突然的，意外的；唐突的，鲁莽的

参考例句：

• The river takes an abrupt bend to the west.这河突然向西转弯。
• His abrupt reply hurt our feelings.他粗鲁的回答伤了我们的感情。

7 cascade   

n.小瀑布，喷流；层叠；vi.成瀑布落下

参考例句：

• She watched the magnificent waterfall cascade down the mountainside.她看着壮观的瀑布从山坡上倾泻而下。
• Her hair fell over her shoulders in a cascade of curls.她的卷发像瀑布一样垂在肩上。

8 retired   

adj.隐退的，退休的，退役的

参考例句：

• The old man retired to the country for rest.这位老人下乡休息去了。
• Many retired people take up gardening as a hobby.许多退休的人都以从事园艺为嗜好。

9 oversaw   

v.监督，监视( oversee的过去式 )

参考例句：

• He will go down as the president who oversaw two historic transitions. 他将作为见证了巴西两次历史性转变的总统，安然引退。 来自互联网
• Dixon oversaw the project as creative director of Design Research Studio. 狄克逊监督项目的创意总监设计研究工作室。 来自互联网

10 briefly   

adv.简单地，简短地

参考例句：

• I want to touch briefly on another aspect of the problem.我想简单地谈一下这个问题的另一方面。
• He was kidnapped and briefly detained by a terrorist group.他被一个恐怖组织绑架并短暂拘禁。

11 vice   

n.坏事；恶习；[pl.]台钳，老虎钳；adj.副的

参考例句：

• He guarded himself against vice.他避免染上坏习惯。
• They are sunk in the depth of vice.他们堕入了罪恶的深渊。

12 resurgence   

n.再起，复活，再现

参考例句：

• A resurgence of his grief swept over Nim.悲痛又涌上了尼姆的心头。
• Police say drugs traffickers are behind the resurgence of violence.警方说毒贩是暴力活动重新抬头的罪魁祸首。

13 essentially   

adv.本质上，实质上，基本上

参考例句：

• Really great men are essentially modest.真正的伟人大都很谦虚。
• She is an essentially selfish person.她本质上是个自私自利的人。

14 ethnic   

adj.人种的，种族的，异教徒的

参考例句：

• This music would sound more ethnic if you played it in steel drums.如果你用钢鼓演奏，这首乐曲将更具民族特色。
• The plan is likely only to aggravate ethnic frictions.这一方案很有可能只会加剧种族冲突。

15 displacement   

n.移置，取代，位移，排水量

参考例句：

• They said that time is the feeling of spatial displacement.他们说时间是空间位移的感觉。
• The displacement of all my energy into caring for the baby.我所有精力都放在了照顾宝宝上。

16 cleansing   

n. 净化(垃圾) adj. 清洁用的 动词cleanse的现在分词

参考例句：

• medicated cleansing pads for sensitive skin 敏感皮肤药物清洗棉
• Soap is not the only cleansing agent. 肥皂并不是唯一的清洁剂。

17 frankly   

adv.坦白地，直率地；坦率地说

参考例句：

• To speak frankly, I don't like the idea at all.老实说，我一点也不赞成这个主意。
• Frankly speaking, I'm not opposed to reform.坦率地说，我不反对改革。

18 withdrawal   

n.取回，提款；撤退，撤军；收回，撤销

参考例句：

• The police were forced to make a tactical withdrawal.警方被迫进行战术撤退。
• They insisted upon a withdrawal of the statement and a public apology.他们坚持要收回那些话并公开道歉。

19 reassure   

v.使放心，使消除疑虑

参考例句：

• This seemed to reassure him and he continued more confidently.这似乎使他放心一点，于是他更有信心地继续说了下去。
• The airline tried to reassure the customers that the planes were safe.航空公司尽力让乘客相信飞机是安全的。

20 fully   

adv.完全地，全部地，彻底地；充分地

参考例句：

• The doctor asked me to breathe in,then to breathe out fully.医生让我先吸气，然后全部呼出。
• They soon became fully integrated into the local community.他们很快就完全融入了当地人的圈子。

21 affordable   

adj.支付得起的，不太昂贵的

参考例句：

• The rent for the four-roomed house is affordable.四居室房屋的房租付得起。
• There are few affordable apartments in big cities.在大城市中没有几所公寓是便宜的。

22 noted   

adj.著名的，知名的

参考例句：

• The local hotel is noted for its good table.当地的那家酒店以餐食精美而著称。
• Jim is noted for arriving late for work.吉姆上班迟到出了名。

23 outspoken   

adj.直言无讳的，坦率的，坦白无隐的

参考例句：

• He was outspoken in his criticism.他在批评中直言不讳。
• She is an outspoken critic of the school system in this city.她是这座城市里学校制度的坦率的批评者。

24 inclination   

n.倾斜；点头；弯腰；斜坡；倾度；倾向；爱好

参考例句：

• She greeted us with a slight inclination of the head.她微微点头向我们致意。
• I did not feel the slightest inclination to hurry.我没有丝毫着急的意思。

25 defense   

n.防御，保卫；[pl.]防务工事；辩护，答辩

参考例句：

• The accused has the right to defense.被告人有权获得辩护。
• The war has impacted the area with military and defense workers.战争使那个地区挤满了军队和防御工程人员。

26 partisan   

adj.党派性的；游击队的；n.游击队员；党徒

参考例句：

• In their anger they forget all the partisan quarrels.愤怒之中，他们忘掉一切党派之争。
• The numerous newly created partisan detachments began working slowly towards that region.许多新建的游击队都开始慢慢地向那里移动。

27 chaotic   

adj.混沌的，一片混乱的，一团糟的

参考例句：

• Things have been getting chaotic in the office recently.最近办公室的情况越来越乱了。
• The traffic in the city was chaotic.这城市的交通糟透了。

28 forth   

adv.向前；向外，往外

参考例句：

• The wind moved the trees gently back and forth.风吹得树轻轻地来回摇晃。
• He gave forth a series of works in rapid succession.他很快连续发表了一系列的作品。

29 salvage   

v.救助，营救，援救；n.救助，营救

参考例句：

• All attempts to salvage the wrecked ship failed.抢救失事船只的一切努力都失败了。
• The salvage was piled upon the pier.抢救出的财产被堆放在码头上。

30 salvaged   

（从火灾、海难等中）抢救（某物）( salvage的过去式和过去分词 )； 回收利用（某物）

参考例句：

• The investigators studied flight recorders salvaged from the wreckage. 调查者研究了从飞机残骸中找到的黑匣子。
• The team's first task was to decide what equipment could be salvaged. 该队的首要任务是决定可以抢救哪些设备。